Front Main Seal

[bs175dths]

It appears the front seal is leaking.
Can this be replaced?
Has anyone else done this?
All suggestions are welcomed.

-(not) Riding On (at the moment)

[Poorboy]

It appears the front seal is leaking.
Can this be replaced?
Has anyone else done this?
All suggestions are welcomed.

-(not) Riding On (at the moment)

Yes, the front crankshaft is replaceable, but it is getting hard to find. There is a thread on here ( somewhere) about using the front crankshaft seal from a 1500.

Poorboy

[bs175dths]

I have been doing some reading and have found mixed reviews about using the 1500 seal as a replacement for the not available 1200 seal.
The biggest reason folks say it won't work is the 1200 and the 1500 cranks rotate in different directions. Not that these folks have tried it and it failed, but that it failed in theory.
Another suggestion was to use a sealer restorer (a chemical which will cause the seal to swell, thus stopping the leak). I am not fond of that idea!

Removing the seal may be a challenge given it is supposed to have a lip on it to help keep it in place where the 1500 does not have said lip.
Using a dent puller was suggested to remove the old seal.

I did have some weeping 40K miles ago when I replaced the timing belts and the addition of a V-belt external alternator may have added to the cause of the leak.
However, I am running my v-belt a bit loose knowing a v-belt will put more stain on the crank seal than a multi-ribbed belt, but the v-belt is all I had at the time.

More research will supply the answers I need to make my decision on a proper fix as I would rather repair the bike than use it as a parts bike.

All suggestions, comments, opinions, experiences are welcomed.

Thanks in advance to all.

I will update my progress.

-Ride On

[old gold]

Part Number 91201-MG9-005, GL1200 Front Oil Seal, 35X59X8, on EBay now for USD24.99 $ free shipping.
Part Number 91201-MN5-003, GL1500 Front Oil Seal, 35X59X8, Western Honda fiche, USD8.22 + shipping.
Part Number 91201-MN5-003, GL1500 Front Oil Seal, 35X59X8, on EBay now for USD9.99 + shipping.

[bs175dths]

Thank-you, Thank-you, Thank-you!
Estimated delivery date is the Tuesday before a long weekend.

Guess what I will be doing????

Thanks again for the eyes. I have been off line for several days working, sleeping and working some more...... no time to breathe, so, thanks for the eyes!!

Any suggestions on how to remove it?

-Ride On

[old gold]

Dynamite, C-4, gunpowder, cutting torch, diesel fuel and fertilizer, crowbar & sledge? No, I would try a 3-arm inside gear puller, small prybar and hammer, a seal puller, etc. Whatever you use, don't gouge the casing sides or you'll be using a lot of high-temp RTV to fill the gaps.

[bs175dths]

one suggestion I read was to use a dent puller....
although I was also thinking about using a small gear puller...

don't damage the engine case
don't damage the crank shaft
don't
don't
don't

do be careful
do take your time
do take some pictures (if I remember to do so)

of course, I could always just put in another motor!

I will keep the forum posted......

Thanks all!

[85GL1200I]

I would check Harbor Freight - hate to promote any business on the forum, but they have a great selection of tools at good prices, I bet they have a small puller that will work that won't bust your wallet

[bs175dths]

Thanks as I am open to all suggestions.......

[bs175dths]

In case you were wondering……

Since I was not riding and doing some fact finding prior to locating a GL1200 main oil seal (Thanks PurpleGL1200 who found one on Ebay!) I had other parts I had waiting for a good time to install.
This was that time…..

A used, aftermarket rear rotor measuring 6.97mm which once installed REQUIRED the cleaning of the caliper pistons of road grim, which once removed from the caliper REQUIRED new caliper piston seals and dust seals.
When I installed the new rear tire a week before the main oil seal started to leak, the 29 year-old swing arm boot decided to tear which REQUIRED a new boot.
I wanted to replace the gas shocks the PO had installed in place of his defective factory air shocks because they were bottoming out with just me on the bike and were not adjustable – I cleaned and resealed a pair of GL1200 air shocks I found on Ebay.
I used black, Rancho Shock Boots (RS1952) to replace the missing shock boots – btw, other colors for the boots are available and a second zip tie will be required.
Since I had 40K on the timing belts, I decided it would be a good time to replace those as well – Mituboshi (not Mitubishi) CD070 (same as Gates T070).
The oring on the lower water outlet on the engine was in need of replacement so it was replaced.
The lower saddlebag support on the 1984 bikes is not as robust as on later bikes. Both of my lower supports broke at the forward hold down point (the one under the bags) so I repaired both of those.
Replaced my two year old NGK spark plugs and found too much road debris had collected in the spark plug holes. The drain holes were clear but there was just an accumulation of grit around each plug.
I cleaned out the inside of the timing belt covers as well as the face of the engine block.

SWING ARM BOOT (52105-463-010) was replaced without having to drop the exhaust. With the final drive removed (rear shocks removed) and the u-joint pushed all the way to the back, the boot will go on. Just be careful not to tear the new boot. Also be aware the boot is directional. There is a ‘UP’ on the boot. Also, make sure the boot lip goes over the swing arm all the way around the swing arm. It is very difficult to see. I was able to see by looking under the bike (working on the ground, my head barely fit) and used a long, blunt, slot screw driver to get the boot over the swing arm lip.
Moly 60 on the u-joint and output shaft as well as the final drive splines.
The band which goes around the boot to hold it in place is no longer available through Mother Honda, so treat it with care.

The rear of the bike is back together, all lubed and aligned, brakes are assembled and bled. The saddle bag supports and trunk are installed except for the left saddle bag in case I want to bleed the brakes some more.

Since I have a GL1200 front main oil seal (91201-MG9-005) I decided to try the GL1500 front main oil seal (91201-MN5-003). If it leaks, I will install the GL1200 seal. If not, I will keep record of how long the GL1500 seal lasts.
Here’s to hoping…..
Timing belts are installed. I checked the timing marks 4X before putting the timing belt covers back on.
The alternator belt is installed and needs final adjusting.
Then the radiator needs installing before I can fire her up.

The original thread started Nov. 14 and here it is almost 4 weeks. I suspect the carburetors are not going to be happy and a cleaning and sync will be in order. The battery has been on the Tender so it is ready to go when I am ready.

Between losing an hour of daylight due to the time change, record lows, the rain (I have to work outside) and the Holiday Season, I have had little time to work on her…… but I am making progress.

I will post pictures and procedure when the job is done and I have some miles on the repair(s).

-Ride On

[bs175dths]

My last entry was 12/6 and here it is 12/30……..
If the Christmas season wasn’t enough to deal with, the household was hit with a little bug causing vomiting and diarrhea, striking three out of seven of us and it almost got me!
Fortunately the worst is over in less than 18 hours, but recovery can take several days. All have recovered!
My Mother-in-Law, my daughter’s boyfriend and his parents all shared the same “joy” this little bug bestowed.
Needless to say, the progress on the bike came to a screeching halt!

I was able to finish her up enough this past Saturday to do some 2 or so miles of test riding.
Yesterday I put another 5 or so, on the bike along with some idle time.
This morning I rode her into work (32 freeway miles) and so far, no oil is leaking.

I plan on cleaning the underside and the engine so as to spot oil leaking at its earliest.

Again, I have installed the seal for the GL1500 (p/n 91201-MN5-003) to see if it a viable replacement for the now obsolete seal for the GL1200 (p/n 91201-MG9-006-5).
Thanks to PurpleGL1200, I do have the GL1200 seal, so if the GL1500 seal fails, I have the GL1200 I can install.
There is some work involved with this experiment so it would be REALLY nice if the GL1500 does work. Even if it doesn’t make it to 100,000 like the original, I would like to see how far the GL1500 will take me.
IAC, the bike is back on the road with a new lease on life.

I want to thank PurpleGL1200, those who posted their input, the Administrators and the Site Owner for helping me get her back on her feet (?) and on the road.

BTW - Dynamite, C-4, gunpowder, cutting torch, diesel fuel and fertilizer, crowbar & sledge were not required to remove the old seal. (but thanks for the suggestion PurpleGL1200!!)
I drilled a small pilot hole and using the same drill bit, measured how deep the hole was and transferred that depth to a large sheet metal screw which I had filed the point off the tip.
I used an inexpensive slide hammer I found at Harbor Freight (thanks 85GL1200I) and the seal was out after only two slides of the hammer.

Thanks again folks and I hope this helps others faced with the same situation.

For now I am…….

[bs175dths]

I have only logged 900 miles on the front, main seal of a GL1500 when I started to have issues with the breather system.
Getting that cleared up, the left head gasket gave away after only 29,000 miles. I can’t tell if it is a defective head gasket, defective orifice o ring, incorrect installation, all the the above or none of the above.
It appears the oil orifice was leaking oil on the head gasket material between the cylinders.
Getting that repaired/replaced and now the bike is down with a bad water pump.
Apparently an o ring in the water circuit has been leaking, as well as the oil seal on the oil pump.
Since the road grim plugged the weep hole, it took the worn bearing of the water pump to cause the impeller to make contact with the inside of the engine front cover creating a ‘screeching’ sound when I tuned the engine off after going on a test ride after replacing the head gasket.

I have compiled a list of needed parts (pump, thermostat, o rings, gaskets and coolant) and will be securing parts shortly.
In the meantime, I am cleaning the mess left by the undetected turmoil which has been taking place within the heart of my GL.

But, to report on the use of the GL1500 front, main oil seal…. Granted it has been less than 1000 miles, but it is all as clean as it was the day I installed it.
Time and (s)miles will tell and I plan on coming back to this thread to give updates.

-Ride On

[bs175dths]

… a week shy of two months and I am almost there…..

A water pump, flat washers, several o rings, flat gaskets, thermostat, flushing three times with distilled water, oil filter, fresh oil (since using Seafoam to clean the oil and water from behind the transmission cover I am convinced the oil was contaminated).
I am still not convinced the bike isn’t overheating.
The stationary running in order to flush the cooling system contributes to the system running hotter than normal.
Body panels and the open road will be the real test.

But the saga continues……..

Having sat for such a long time, the carburetors need attention. While it has its body panels off, I am going to give the carburetors the once over.
As a special note: I noticed the inability to synchronize the carburetors due to the lower support for the external alternator is blocking access to that one intake manifold.
I didn’t trim the rear leg off my alternator and so I can’t get it as close as some installations, although the body work does hide the alternator as good as if I had trimmed the alternator.
Before removing the carburetors for service, I will mark where a hole needs to be drilled in order to gain access to the intake screw so I can synchronize the carburetors.

Even with Daylight Savings, my time is limited since the birth of my first grandchild, Ryder.
Our daughter lives with us and my mother-in-law (retired), my wife and the rest of the family and I take care of him while his mother is at work.

Dead Beat Dad (son-in-law) was kicked out of the house by his wife (our daughter) after it was found out he had been stealing and pawning all the gold jewelry in the house.
Having served two tours in the Army before being Less-Than Honorably discharged, he cited he couldn’t (shouldn’t) work.
He stole and pawned jewelry, video games, and some tools. He took his sons gift cards from the baby shower, bought video games, then pawned those.
This was all done in order to feed his meth and marijuana habit.
He’s out of the house now and living in Nevada, stealing, pawning and meth-ing out there.
Arrested and given 18 months rehab. in a rehab house only to be kicked out in less than a week for being drunk.

At present, he has two bench warrants but is still out and about.

So, I have precious little time and am limited to being able to spend ten minutes here and 15 minutes there, in order to work on my ride.
It is slow progress, but it is progress…….

I will keep you posted.

-Ride(less) On

[bs175dths]

last entry: 4-01-2014
today 2-9-2017:

UPDATE:
A front main oil seal (91201-MN5-003) from the GL1500 was used in place of the correct seal for a GL1200. Even though I was able to locate the proper seal, I wanted to 'TEST' the use of the GL1500 to see if it was a viable source for the now obsolete seal of the GL1200.
Read the discussions for why and why not to get up to speed.

For me, as noted in the transmission repair thread, I am getting away from GL1200 after 8 years of fun, and going another route.
The update here is, the GL1500 seal is showing now signs of oil seeping after 6000 miles.
Here is the situation -
GL1200 oil seal, 91201-MG9-005 OBSOLETE
GL1500 oil seal, 91201-MN5-003 $8.42 (2/2017)

I would think, if the gl1500 seal will give 10, 15, or 20K miles of use, for 9 bucks, that is far better than living with an engine with a leaking main seal, tossing the engine, or tossing the bike.

I think the GL1500 seal is a good substitute for the now obsolete GL1200 seal.

my .02.

-Ride On